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	<title>Comments on: 2010 Trends: Alternate Computing Emergence and Convergence</title>
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	<link>https://edutechdebate.org/2010-ict4e-trends/2010-trends-alternate-computing-emergence-and-convergence/</link>
	<description>Educational Technology Debate</description>
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		<title>By: Cavin Mugarura</title>
		<link>https://edutechdebate.org/2010-ict4e-trends/2010-trends-alternate-computing-emergence-and-convergence/comment-page-1/#comment-1368</link>
		<dc:creator>Cavin Mugarura</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jan 2010 14:27:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edutechdebate.org/?p=648#comment-1368</guid>
		<description>Its interesting that in talking about the difference between Thin Clients and Virtual Desktops, you talk about the difference between the thin client and the PC. In your earlier post you mentioned that NComputing&#039;s devices are not thin clients, and they are actually virtual desktops. And that was my interest. There was little need to go to Google or Wikipedia, to explain your choice of words, which you have failed to explain. 
 
So we can disagree, but i will call them thin clients, because that&#039;s what they are. You have consistently avoided to mention the price of these &#039;super devices&#039;.  
I will conclude by saying that the principle behind this super technology (Thin clients) is very good but the high costs involved in the acquisition will mean, they will be relegated to isolated installations around the globe (read Developing countries). </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Its interesting that in talking about the difference between Thin Clients and Virtual Desktops, you talk about the difference between the thin client and the PC. In your earlier post you mentioned that NComputing&#039;s devices are not thin clients, and they are actually virtual desktops. And that was my interest. There was little need to go to Google or Wikipedia, to explain your choice of words, which you have failed to explain. </p>
<p>So we can disagree, but i will call them thin clients, because that&#039;s what they are. You have consistently avoided to mention the price of these &#039;super devices&#039;.<br />
I will conclude by saying that the principle behind this super technology (Thin clients) is very good but the high costs involved in the acquisition will mean, they will be relegated to isolated installations around the globe (read Developing countries).</p>
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		<title>By: Cavin Mugarura</title>
		<link>https://edutechdebate.org/2010-ict4e-trends/2010-trends-alternate-computing-emergence-and-convergence/comment-page-1/#comment-1367</link>
		<dc:creator>Cavin Mugarura</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jan 2010 14:11:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edutechdebate.org/?p=648#comment-1367</guid>
		<description>I have read the post, however the excel file is missing, your calculations are based on simulations and not live data, so its just a hypothesis. You can claim 4%, 89% or any figure, but you have no data to back it up. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have read the post, however the excel file is missing, your calculations are based on simulations and not live data, so its just a hypothesis. You can claim 4%, 89% or any figure, but you have no data to back it up.</p>
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		<title>By: mbeckford</title>
		<link>https://edutechdebate.org/2010-ict4e-trends/2010-trends-alternate-computing-emergence-and-convergence/comment-page-1/#comment-1366</link>
		<dc:creator>mbeckford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jan 2010 11:48:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edutechdebate.org/?p=648#comment-1366</guid>
		<description>Thin Client definition: &lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thin_client&quot; target=&quot;_blank&quot;&gt;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thin_client&lt;/a&gt; 
 
&quot;Ultra-thin&quot; client or &quot;zero client&quot; mentioned in this link is closest to what I consider a virtual desktop.  Thin client is different than a PC in that the CPU is lower-end, has no hard drives or optical drives (uses flash).  Costs are the about the same with a PC.  Virtual desktops have no OS, no CPU, no HDD, etc.  They just provide an interface for keyboards and mice.  Software is loaded on a PC that allows multiple virtual user sessions to be distributed to multiple separate client devices.  
 
You can get many of these questions answered through Google or Wikipedia. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thin Client definition: <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thin_client" target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thin_client</a> </p>
<p>&quot;Ultra-thin&quot; client or &quot;zero client&quot; mentioned in this link is closest to what I consider a virtual desktop.  Thin client is different than a PC in that the CPU is lower-end, has no hard drives or optical drives (uses flash).  Costs are the about the same with a PC.  Virtual desktops have no OS, no CPU, no HDD, etc.  They just provide an interface for keyboards and mice.  Software is loaded on a PC that allows multiple virtual user sessions to be distributed to multiple separate client devices.  </p>
<p>You can get many of these questions answered through Google or Wikipedia.</p>
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		<title>By: mbeckford</title>
		<link>https://edutechdebate.org/2010-ict4e-trends/2010-trends-alternate-computing-emergence-and-convergence/comment-page-1/#comment-1365</link>
		<dc:creator>mbeckford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jan 2010 11:38:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edutechdebate.org/?p=648#comment-1365</guid>
		<description>Total cost of ownership (TCO) calculations. You can find a discussion on an article I posted to this site here: &lt;a href=&quot;http://edutechdebate.org/individal-and-communal-computer-usage/increased-computing-saturation-requires-cost-effective-solutions/&quot; target=&quot;_blank&quot;&gt;http://edutechdebate.org/individal-and-communal-c...&lt;/a&gt; 
 
I reference 60%, but we&#039;ve seen savings on actual deals up to 75%.   </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Total cost of ownership (TCO) calculations. You can find a discussion on an article I posted to this site here: <a href="http://edutechdebate.org/individal-and-communal-computer-usage/increased-computing-saturation-requires-cost-effective-solutions/" target="_blank">http://edutechdebate.org/individal-and-communal-c&#8230;</a> </p>
<p>I reference 60%, but we&#039;ve seen savings on actual deals up to 75%.</p>
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		<title>By: Cavin Mugarura</title>
		<link>https://edutechdebate.org/2010-ict4e-trends/2010-trends-alternate-computing-emergence-and-convergence/comment-page-1/#comment-1357</link>
		<dc:creator>Cavin Mugarura</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Jan 2010 14:52:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edutechdebate.org/?p=648#comment-1357</guid>
		<description>please explain the difference between thin clients and virtual desktops. There is an interesting argument, that OLPC will not achieve 1:1 computing, which is not the aim for OLPC. Even if you try to achieve 1:1, are you saying its easier to achieve 1:1 computing with more expensive equipment (read Ncomputing/Thin clients/Virtual Desktops), and harder with cheaper alternatives (OLPC).  </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>please explain the difference between thin clients and virtual desktops. There is an interesting argument, that OLPC will not achieve 1:1 computing, which is not the aim for OLPC. Even if you try to achieve 1:1, are you saying its easier to achieve 1:1 computing with more expensive equipment (read Ncomputing/Thin clients/Virtual Desktops), and harder with cheaper alternatives (OLPC).</p>
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		<title>By: Cavin Mugarura</title>
		<link>https://edutechdebate.org/2010-ict4e-trends/2010-trends-alternate-computing-emergence-and-convergence/comment-page-1/#comment-1356</link>
		<dc:creator>Cavin Mugarura</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Jan 2010 14:46:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edutechdebate.org/?p=648#comment-1356</guid>
		<description>&quot;and with virtual desktops at 75% of the lifetime cost of an XO,&quot;, please explain how you came up with these figures </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&quot;and with virtual desktops at 75% of the lifetime cost of an XO,&quot;, please explain how you came up with these figures</p>
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		<title>By: mbeckford</title>
		<link>https://edutechdebate.org/2010-ict4e-trends/2010-trends-alternate-computing-emergence-and-convergence/comment-page-1/#comment-1354</link>
		<dc:creator>mbeckford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Jan 2010 06:27:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edutechdebate.org/?p=648#comment-1354</guid>
		<description>Yes, research demonstrating this value vs. additional access for more students would be useful.  I also think it should be measured on a scale of one&#039;s age/grade.  I would guess the older / higher grade a student is, the more valuable portability becomes.   
 
 </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, research demonstrating this value vs. additional access for more students would be useful.  I also think it should be measured on a scale of one&#039;s age/grade.  I would guess the older / higher grade a student is, the more valuable portability becomes.</p>
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		<title>By: ScottKipp</title>
		<link>https://edutechdebate.org/2010-ict4e-trends/2010-trends-alternate-computing-emergence-and-convergence/comment-page-1/#comment-1353</link>
		<dc:creator>ScottKipp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Jan 2010 06:20:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edutechdebate.org/?p=648#comment-1353</guid>
		<description>They are of course used in many different ways, and context is only one of the reasons why.   
 
The home use of the XO is one characteristic of it, yes, but even with home use, over time we are not seeing much &quot;critical development&quot; of the use of the software.  At home they repeat the games (memorize, draw), and take more pictures.   
 
Battery life at the thin client lab is 6 - 8 hours / day, the panels charge the batteries, which then go on to power through the inverter well after dusk.   
 
If the delays in using the XO were not so frequent and time-consuming (flimsy touchpad, system crashes, etc), I would be more inclined to invest the project in them.  </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>They are of course used in many different ways, and context is only one of the reasons why.   </p>
<p>The home use of the XO is one characteristic of it, yes, but even with home use, over time we are not seeing much &quot;critical development&quot; of the use of the software.  At home they repeat the games (memorize, draw), and take more pictures.   </p>
<p>Battery life at the thin client lab is 6 &#8211; 8 hours / day, the panels charge the batteries, which then go on to power through the inverter well after dusk.   </p>
<p>If the delays in using the XO were not so frequent and time-consuming (flimsy touchpad, system crashes, etc), I would be more inclined to invest the project in them.</p>
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		<title>By: ScottKipp</title>
		<link>https://edutechdebate.org/2010-ict4e-trends/2010-trends-alternate-computing-emergence-and-convergence/comment-page-1/#comment-1352</link>
		<dc:creator>ScottKipp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Jan 2010 06:15:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edutechdebate.org/?p=648#comment-1352</guid>
		<description>We typically deploy 4 termanals to each server, which itself is a laptop.  For a lab of this set-up, including solar panels and battery arsenal and cable, roughly $3500.  The WYSE warranties are for the 3 years, laptop warranty varying by design.  We typically use Dells than can handle running Windows Server.  
 
But I reiterate that warranty and tech support are not &quot;apples and mangoes&quot; as you say.  The warranty is an indicative comfort, but realistically no manufacturer would be replacing or validating a warranty on a machine put in this environment.  The actual benefit of a warranty is much like tech support:  it exists on paper only.   
 
It is not comparing the technology itself that helps students at the end of the school day, it is how they made use of the technology.  In rural areas, where teacher training is low and access to support nonexistent, the thin clients provide a better service, simply put.  I would be interested to learn what you mean by &quot;using them optimally&quot; in regards to the XO, because we have tried everything.  What do mean by &quot;optimally&quot; exactly?  That which engages the children and excites them about learning? Because their favorite programs (Record, TamTam) are those which use up the most battery life.  Should we have them doing rote copying from the chalkboard on to the XO, contrary to student-centered teaching, just so that we can &quot;optimize&quot; the battery life?  Seems antithetical to the project&#039;s purpose.  
 
I should note I wish we were on the beach, but no...just in the middle of a serious drought! </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We typically deploy 4 termanals to each server, which itself is a laptop.  For a lab of this set-up, including solar panels and battery arsenal and cable, roughly $3500.  The WYSE warranties are for the 3 years, laptop warranty varying by design.  We typically use Dells than can handle running Windows Server.  </p>
<p>But I reiterate that warranty and tech support are not &quot;apples and mangoes&quot; as you say.  The warranty is an indicative comfort, but realistically no manufacturer would be replacing or validating a warranty on a machine put in this environment.  The actual benefit of a warranty is much like tech support:  it exists on paper only.   </p>
<p>It is not comparing the technology itself that helps students at the end of the school day, it is how they made use of the technology.  In rural areas, where teacher training is low and access to support nonexistent, the thin clients provide a better service, simply put.  I would be interested to learn what you mean by &quot;using them optimally&quot; in regards to the XO, because we have tried everything.  What do mean by &quot;optimally&quot; exactly?  That which engages the children and excites them about learning? Because their favorite programs (Record, TamTam) are those which use up the most battery life.  Should we have them doing rote copying from the chalkboard on to the XO, contrary to student-centered teaching, just so that we can &quot;optimize&quot; the battery life?  Seems antithetical to the project&#039;s purpose.  </p>
<p>I should note I wish we were on the beach, but no&#8230;just in the middle of a serious drought!</p>
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		<title>By: Ed Gaible </title>
		<link>https://edutechdebate.org/2010-ict4e-trends/2010-trends-alternate-computing-emergence-and-convergence/comment-page-1/#comment-1350</link>
		<dc:creator>Ed Gaible </dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Jan 2010 05:48:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://edutechdebate.org/?p=648#comment-1350</guid>
		<description>I should amend that first sentence: &quot;Portability is _potentially_ a huge advantage.&quot; Again, it&#039;s a testable idea but without the test. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I should amend that first sentence: &quot;Portability is _potentially_ a huge advantage.&quot; Again, it&#039;s a testable idea but without the test.</p>
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